Vaughan, Jordahl Interview – Podcast August 24, 2025

Defending Immigrants Against A Cruel Government. Steve Williamson and Karen McClelland welcome Mik Jordahl and Grace Vaughan to discuss immigration issues in northern Arizona. Jordahl is an attorney and frequent guest on Democratic Perspective. And Vaughan is Legal Services Program Director for Northern Arizona Immigration Legal Services (NAILS) in Flagstaff which provides free or low-cost services for both documented and undocumented immigrants.

Regarding the current situation, Vaughan says, “There is a lot of fear. There’s a lot of apprehension and there’s a lot of unknown, people saying I don’t understand what is happening, and I don’t know what I should be afraid of right now.”

Asked about the actions of heavily armed masked ICE agents, Jordahl responds, “Well, I mean I haven’t been wrestled to the ground by a masked person, but I think it’s very dangerous because how do people know who these people are? They say they’re ICE, but there have been, I think, documented instances of people who are not ICE who say they are.” He continues, “It goes back to the era of secret police. It feels like that. And I think it’s part and parcel of the intent to create fear.”

Vaughan and Jordahl go on to detail the negative impact of mass deportation and what NAILS can do to help immigrants facing deportation.

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